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 Legends Update Thread 
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Minion
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ManicMan wrote:
Not really too big.. i'm reading right now and not seeing anything that wasn't known.. they have taken a money hit due to delay (every company that has a delay does that) and due to the manufacture issue at the moment which last I heard, yesterday or the day before, was looking hopeful for sorting something out, appears to have something sorted out (yay), some items are delayed but work is being done on that..

I see some guy called 'Kelsch' seams to be having a major hissy fit..

Ah, so unlike what some of them KS comments seam to say, this is very good and pretty much the only new thing it says is the have the deal with a new manufacture in place? great! that's some good news, thanks


Except he's saying that Legends won't be being manufactured until Starfinder and Relic Knights are done.

Also, by saying "get the project sorted and paid for" he's alluding to the fact that there is a money issue. To what degree is unknown.


July 12th, 2018, 8:52 pm
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Except he's saying that Legends won't be being manufactured until Starfinder and Relic Knights are done.


Does that hold also include everything outside of Legends, such as core box 2.0, SDA Arcade (Midnight tower) and Wave 1 monster collections?


July 12th, 2018, 8:56 pm
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prodigal_dreamer wrote:
Except he's saying that Legends won't be being manufactured until Starfinder and Relic Knights are done.


Without looking back a bit and some of the comments are hard to find, I think that was said about before some time back.. it's annoying but i'm pretty sure something along them lines were officially said.

prodigal_dreamer wrote:
Also, by saying "get the project sorted and paid for" he's alluding to the fact that there is a money issue. To what degree is unknown.


We know they spilt it into two waves which cost them. We know there were delays, which cost them. It might be just to do with the industry or how Americans work with others but a lot of manufactures I find will take a deposit on a order and you can pay the rest later. With the delays caused, and false starts, money would have gone down. If it's to any point where I would refer to money as an issue.. I'm not sure. It's guess work on both accounts. Personally, I would have each divisional group (I'm not saying they are set in stone groups that only work on ONE product here, but groups can be kinda loose groups of people that share many groups) has it's own budget which deals with both income and outcome. Legends has clearly taken more then the expected outcome with a low point in income. IF that money has to come from another part of the budget, or what often happens in companies is that they take a 'loan' from one part of the budget and then pay it back, then fine. I would say it's an issue when outcome is far greater then income for a while, often defined as a couple of years. I would be interested to know if they have had to take a business loan.. the American government did screw up with china via all them backhanders ¬_¬ not for the first time either.. that's probably hurt them a fair bit too.

In England, we still haven't recovered from the screw up that Gordon Brown's group left us in..

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July 12th, 2018, 9:02 pm
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Here are some key discussions (that remain polite from all sides) collected and slightly edited:

John Cadice wrote:
We have a delayed project, it sucks, and we are working on it daily. When this snowball hit us last year, we had 5 outstanding Kickstarters we needed to dig out from under, we have delivered 2, we are delivering 2 currently, and the biggest project that needs the most attention will be when we can lock ALL missiles on the target and get it done.

Situations change, and we have to change with it to deliver. What was true one day, changes the next, the volatility of these situations, though beyond your grasp, we have tried to share, sometimes with success, sometimes with folly or false information provided to us - yet the constant remains, we are working through our troubles, delivering on our obligations (however late), we have regrettably had to withhold refunds until we deliver on projects and stem the bleeding of cost overruns and explosion of scope.

If you asked for a refund, you will get one, we will service it as soon as able. If you have any more questions, I am sure I will be seeing you soon.

To the backers reading this, thank you for your patience, we genuinely love you and are closer each day. To echo our recent posts online and in the updates, we will move content and background updates to the website, we will continue to show new dimensions of the content we have generated, we will continue to maintain a steady stream of new miniatures until and after release of 2.0 and Legends, and we will update the Kickstarter ONLY with verified and definite information regarding the start of manufacturing and delivery.
We love you all!


John Cadice wrote:
Eric J Beck wrote:
John Starck Cadice, thanks for engaging with the community. I am sorry it has turned largely into ad hominem attacks. I want to believe you when you say you are closer each day, but the last update that even mentioned anything about progress was months ago on March 23. Even that update simply said that we won't be told anything until milestones have been achieved. If you are truly getting closer every day, what is being accomplished or what is standing in the way of things being accomplished? I don't want to know all the company secrets, but I feel completely in the dark on a project that I invested a significant amount of money in (significant for me). At this point, I would consider any progress a milestone, not just the big ones of production, shipping, etc. For example, the March 23rd update said you had to move production to a new manufacturer. Some milestones in that process would be finding the new manufacturer, signing a contract, and new molds being made (if necessary). As far as I know, the new manufacturer hasn't even been chosen yet. I don't want to engage in any of the rampant speculation, but I have no actual information available to me about the status of the project. Could you please give us details about something that points to progress being made toward finishing the project?

This is all true, timetables and resources need to align, we are chipping away at and delivering on our other KS obligations in as strategic a way as possible to ensure we are not spreading ourselves thinner and dropping ALL the balls. Its a real risk, as the explosion in scope really hit hard - the product is now 2 or more KSs in content, and we have to take small bites to get it done. Its the biggest hairiest one, and requires time to move other elements in the business along as well.
So, yes, we have a new manufacturer, we are still working on elements with our old one. A full push to manufacturing is to greenlight the mold making process and purchasing of material to start the engines. The new manufacturer has offered great pricing and quality to meet our needs, so when we go, we can run separate projects, hopefully to deliver more quicker, at the very least, with some molds done and locked up at one of the factories, we will keep manufacturing with these partners as well. As there are multiple box printings, miniature sets, and materials to make.
Summarizing our progress to date:
We have COMPLETELY sculpted, designed, tested, laid out EVERY CORE product and miniatures set in the first waves of content barring the Legends Box itself, which is slotted for manufacturing in the last wave after 2.0, Arcade, and the minis hit.
We are finishing up Starfinder, starting Relic Knights delivery, and trying to streamline our operation to be more effective and to NEVER have problems like this again - the rest is our business until we can get verified confirmation that we can and have started the key milestones needed to activate and manufacture the first waves of products. Starter boxes, minis, all of it.


John Cadice wrote:
Eric J Beck wrote:
John Starck Cadice, thank you so much for that reply. I really appreciate you taking the time to go through it with me/us. May I ask if I am understanding you correctly? What I think you are saying, among other things, is that production of the Super Dungeon Kickstarter is on hold until you have cleared out some or all of your other kickstarter obligations. In that respect, daily progress toward the completion of SD is largely tied to the daily progress towards the completion of other kickstarters. I don't have a business mind, so I understand if I am oversimplifying or just plain wrong. But, I want to best utilise your attention while I have it and make sure I am understanding you to the best of my ability.

We had to rejigger a lot of things with the slippage, and as they began to run together we were losing focus and not being efficient with our resources. So, the operating strategy is ... one bite at a time, slow down and do it right, dont over extend.
With studio freed up for some while, we moved to make the minis we are putting up online for the community, a way to get you guys stuff while there was a gap. Running after everything was going to burn us worse, and we would be putting out fires, and not fixing the problem.
Thank you for asking Eric,


John Cadice wrote:
Nicholas E. Kelsch wrote:
John Starck Cadice You didn't actually answer his question... So all SDE Kickstarter tasks are 100% paused until other KS finish? So "the operating strategy is ... one bite at a time, slow down and do it right, dont over extend. " = "the SDE Kickstarter is paused and not moving forward until WotF and Starfinder are 100% done"?

WotF is delivered, Starfinder is underway, Relic Knights is underway, - and no, not 100% complete, but off and running, and managable to begin to engage the same human resources on delivering the next projects - time/money/schedule.

We still have work on the final Legends box content, so that continues as we have a bit of time. Current product cannot start until we are ready. Spending all your shekels at once means we bury a company and you guys never get your products.


John Cadice wrote:
Nakano wrote:
I would like to hear:
* How the Kickstarter projects are prioritized? Rail Riders and Way of the Fighter got prioritized probably because of being smaller scope. New game was also recently published/printed in the meantime. Will Legends (at least Wave 1) be prioritized before Relic Knights manufacturing? Above reply suggests, wave 1 was first in (planned) and is going to be last out (manufactured). I tend to see Relic Knights is going to be even more niche than SDE and SDE would sell better in retail.
* I really would like to know what happened with first factory. In KS I appreciated when project creators communicate openly.

Hi there,
First factory has molds for some products, and good printing capability. Costs climb over time, so we have to be proactive to find cost appropriate partners in some cases, as there was a lot of time since our initial quotes, any changes mean more cost on us - so, we are still with them, we still make things and will be making things with them, but to spread around the impact of such a HUGE production run of product, we needed to be as fiscally responsible as able to stabilize impact to our business. We clearly got into hot water with all the simultaneous projects, and attempted to work through them all - we said as much many times, but this one needs to be thought out and done right.
But yes, smaller bites, lower risk, move to a steady delivery and sort them out, then move on to the big monster.

It was also found out that Tetsudo Tower Explore Cards were planned and pdf will become available: "The Caveat being that they (Explore Cards) were designed for Forgotten King, and as we moved to 2.0 footing - we didnt include them because we were phasing them out ... but.... we did make some."


July 12th, 2018, 9:04 pm
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yeah, it was known the cards were made up but not used, I saw that about PDF release which is good, but I don't really use them now with 2.0 rules ^_^

and thanks for collecting that. I see I was wrong in correctly going with ALL Super Dungeon Legends campaign is on hold until after the others. They did put themselves into the bank problem (a Bank NEVER has as much money as people put into it, in order to make a profit with everything (including free accounts), they use the money to lend to people and business. If these go well, they make a nice profile. If there go bad, they just get back the initial money, if they go very bad, they loose the money, all or some. The Bigger the risk, the higher the possible income profit. So over time, they take bigger and bigger risks cause they are finding themselves winning more then loosing by a large amount.. but then, and it wasn't the first time when it happened a few years back, enough big risks fail at the same time.. and the bank takes a big hit, people try to get there money, the bank can't cover it, there is what's called a "Run on the banks", and the bank fails.. SPM did the same kinda thing by having soo many projects on the go.. but to a degree that they pretty much used ONE manufacture.. all eggs.. when something goes bad, BANG, everything is hit and that leads to problems..

we still don't fully know what the problems were but oh well, end of the day, as long as the people that can stop it happening again know, it doesn't really matter to the public..

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July 12th, 2018, 9:15 pm
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ManicMan wrote:
we still don't fully know what the problems were but oh well, end of the day, as long as the people that can stop it happening again know, it doesn't really matter to the public..

I think partially the issue is with manufacturing cost increase: "3 years ago we quoted $x, but today's estimation is $y due to cost differences in gas, material, salary etc. Do you agree this new contract?" They must be trying to find a more affordable partner if possible to manufacture Explore (this initial factory has some molds at least for Arcade). Though if that factory was already working with Explore (white box samples), it's quite strange to change. Yeah like you said, we don't have full picture. Hopefully work gets done regardless.


July 12th, 2018, 9:45 pm
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yeah. problem is with a lot of companies, when you notice the estimate is higher then inflation ^_^ back in the UK, when money was changed to decimal, quite a lot of companies didn't just convert the prices and leave it at that.. they converted then, and then used that time to line up a price increase too. like a local supermarket near me is doing right now.. a lot of there own brand product are being removed from the shelfs, missing for a couple of weeks, then back with the new labelling, designs etc, (and a new branding name) and oh look, price increases but people don't notice at times because its been a couple of weeks..

well, it worked alright for Bewitched... (check up what they did when !SODA! York was kinda forced to leave).

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July 12th, 2018, 9:50 pm
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As a backer of 4 or their last 5 Kickstarter campaigns (I did not back Starfinder, but followed the progress on it), it is not a surprise to me what they are doing.

However, it bothers me that he has always stated that Way of the Fighter is done when not one single miniature have been delivered in that Campaign. He is consistent in stating that WotF is done: when the Starfinder campaign began all the way up to now. But even the last update in Way of the Fighter kickstarter campaign, it was stated that they only have a portion of the figures at the company; and to the best of my knowledge, no one on Kickstarter have received any of those miniatures.

I have been following Starfinder campaign, and it seems only a subset of people are receiving the products they mentioned. I have an uneasy feeling that when products are supposed to be shipped for other Kickstarter projects, it will only be a small percentage of backers receiving it. While another subset of people will be getting it much later (and the worst case: never).

What makes it worse is that they don't elaborate on this to their backers. The "lesson" they supposedly learned with the major backlash from the Starfinder campaign on communicating more efficiently to their backers...have been forgotten/ignored. I understand they are doing what is supposedly in the "best interest of their company"...but man, it is sad and disappointing to see a company that I enjoyed their product so inefficient in managing their product and their communication to their fan base. I hope they can climb out of this hole they got themselves into.


July 12th, 2018, 11:39 pm
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Dumb question probably,

But how up to date is the Print and Play preview on this page https://ninjadivision.com/products/ninj ... ngeon.html ?

And if one were to print it all out, what do you keep from SDE+Forgotten King if anything?


July 13th, 2018, 7:58 am
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Rinion wrote:
Dumb question probably,

But how up to date is the Print and Play preview on this page https://ninjadivision.com/products/ninj ... ngeon.html ?

And if one were to print it all out, what do you keep from SDE+Forgotten King if anything?


I think that is the most up to date PnP version there is (if I'm wrong on that, someone correct me please). As for what is kept from FK era, it's basically just monster/hero stat cards. Those are the same in both versions. The loot deck is compatable, but is balanced slightly differently from the ones in the new arcade and classic versions. The treasure deck is less compatible due to the presence of things like bitey books in the new one though. Otherwise it's pretty obvious stuff like models, tokens, and map sections, those are all still usable.


July 13th, 2018, 8:30 am
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Awesome, thanks! The wifey wants to play and the KS is... well, it is. Also I think the older rules weren't very well received ? its been a while, but flicking through there seems to be some improvement, i hope?


July 13th, 2018, 8:53 am
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the original rules were okay, nothing great.
I liked a lot of the changes with FK but some were a bit iffy, but again they were okay, nothing great.
2.0 Rules are much better. I think it's impossible for many things (or any) to have really great rules, but 2.0 are a good improvement. I love the idea of having pets as an optional add-on cause it just allows people to play with or without them, and if with, they are more out there, if without, then.. well, nothing much. Also the need version of the loot meter as the dungeon tracker is much better then the original meter in my view.

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July 13th, 2018, 9:20 am
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ManicMan wrote:
the original rules were okay, nothing great.
I liked a lot of the changes with FK but some were a bit iffy, but again they were okay, nothing great.
2.0 Rules are much better. I think it's impossible for many things (or any) to have really great rules, but 2.0 are a good improvement. I love the idea of having pets as an optional add-on cause it just allows people to play with or without them, and if with, they are more out there, if without, then.. well, nothing much. Also the need version of the loot meter as the dungeon tracker is much better then the original meter in my view.


Yeah, there are definitely some mixed opinions about FK (which, at the time was largely being referred to as "2.0" lol).

Personally, I liked it well enough -purely because it introduced "Arcade" mode, allowing me to play solo and co-op. That's a pretty big addition, I can't speak to the original experience and it's changes, as 'vs' style gameplay just doesn't hold a lot of appeal in my gaming group. We want to be able to make individual decisions, but still win or lose as a group... Arcade mode scratches that itch, but it also takes several hours to get through a game. Players are getting 2.0 'down' to 2-3 hours now, but even in Arcade mode FK could easily hit or surpass the 4 hour mark -that was a problem. Personally I preferred the visual look of the FK enemies, but that's not to say that I disliked the original set.

2.0 seems to be an improvement across the board, and for that I'm quite grateful. Technically speaking, you COULD grab a couple warbands (or the NAS crossover box, which has more in it), the "Black Hand Henry's" dice pack, and a tile set if you're really interested in getting into the game but don't want the 1.0 core box (FK is much harder to find for a reasonable price in my recent experience). Only thing that would be missing is a proper Boss, but those can be found in a lot of places pretty cheap. You'd still want to print off the PNP materials for 2.0, but you'd have enough to get started and you would probably have a more unique starting experience than most depending on the groups you choose.

One way or another, there are still a number of ways to get into this game right now without waiting for 2.0 to hit shelves.


July 17th, 2018, 5:35 pm
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As figures in pretty much every game, are pretty much proxies, you don't even need to buy some figures.. easy enough to get scans of the cards.. I did wander about making some 'standees' (though they term is really only for the big stuff) of rarer older figures.. Hell if I'm ever gonna get the original Candy&Cola release.... and since SPM have even basically released the cards for the new resins themselves for free, I can make ones for the resins I don't have ^_^.. okay, you could moan they aren't as good, but so? I've very much been In favour of what some companies have done with starter sets for other games where they put in card board flats for the bigger figures which you can go out and buy later. While I want them to make treasure cheats and boo booties are a add-on part (like hearts & Potions), there is no real need.. it helps keep starter set prices down for easier entry into the game through.

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July 17th, 2018, 6:05 pm
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Minion
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Very true.

Makes me wonder, as prices continue to drop over the next five years on decent consumer grade 3D printers, I wonder what effect that's going to have on some miniatures games. More so on things that specialize almost exclusively in selling individuals, like X-Wing, Armada, or basically anything from GW. I could almost see a shift toward selling licensed model files with some companies, as opposed to focusing on shipping plastic from China. We're nowhere near that just yet, but I wouldn't be surprised to see the first instances of it from bigger game companies within five years. Interesting thought at least.


July 19th, 2018, 4:10 pm
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TheHandsomeDan wrote:
Very true.

Makes me wonder, as prices continue to drop over the next five years on decent consumer grade 3D printers, I wonder what effect that's going to have on some miniatures games. More so on things that specialize almost exclusively in selling individuals, like X-Wing, Armada, or basically anything from GW. I could almost see a shift toward selling licensed model files with some companies, as opposed to focusing on shipping plastic from China. We're nowhere near that just yet, but I wouldn't be surprised to see the first instances of it from bigger game companies within five years. Interesting thought at least.

I think we are pretty close. I wouldn't doubt if we see it in the next ten years or less.


July 19th, 2018, 5:06 pm
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not a huge change. 3d Printers that deal with ABS or PLA or really, any other form of Plastic, will NEVER be up to par with plastic casting. for one thing, they will NEVER match the quality or speed. sure, they can come close at times (but very hard) for the quality, they will never be able to match the speed.. there is no physical way to deal with it.. despite some Sci-fi stuff, it just isn't possible with the 3d printer method. Resin printers CAN get bloody good quality but.. well, they are a bit weird and even when the prices come down a bit, a decent Blu-ray laser and resin costs are still a factor, and again, time. It'll always be slower.

While i'm still toying, after doing some work on my printer, I have my first Original Chibi figure (it's basically fan art) that I made all myself ^_^ as in, though I had a bit of help and advice on getting the mesh to work as 3d printable (hole filling etc) I did the design in 3d all myself.. it's not coming out too bad but a lot of clean up work is needed for me.. But the print time is about 24 mins. that's for 1 figure. never gonna match up as commercial gaming..

That said, you are more talking about companies 'Selling' the products as digital download board games. That is kinda already happening. There are a number of third party free games of course, like Dungeon Dolls, which does this. There has been old games that purely existed as freebies in magazines or downloads, for you to make and print from scrap. Problem is one thing that is started to annoying people more and more.. Shifting costs. In the UK atleast, a lot of companies are moving to 'digital wage packets'. So instead of them printing out your wage packet, you need to log into a system and print it yourself.. Basiclly meaning instead of them playing for the paper and ink, You are paying for the paper and ink. At the centre I work at mostly, a lot of our 'business partners' try to run so-called paperless offices.. which basically means they send us the paper work via e-mail or the like. But pretty much ALL the time, it's a non-editable PDF which they expect us to print out and fill in and either scan it back and e-mail to them, or post to them. So they can be 'paperless' and save a pretty large bill in ink and paper, but then WE have to pay out for the ink and paper ¬_¬ most of the time I just cheat and convert the pdf for the manager but it can't always be done.. anyway.. Think about it.. right now, most booster heroes for SDE come out at around £12 (normally you can get them £8-12 pound). IF they decided to release some as the STL files and say, PDF for the cards.. and people to print themselves... well, apart from a lot of people not being happy, I can't logically see the figures moving down in price by more then... maybe £6? £5 at the lowest?.. while PLA isn't pricey, for quality... and the fact a lot of people still don't have printers (I know a couple of people who are interested but they have NO tec skills.. I already pointed out I don't like the printers that are pretty much an uneditable block, like the 'Di Vinci' printers cause they are very limiting, where as something like my cheap one, I can pretty much strip the whole thing down and start again if I wanted. In fact, over time you do a number of improvement tweaks (any one with a 3d printer that doesn't have a cooling fan installed and they won't add one, is an idiot.. trust me on that) also you would need to replace parks. the drive belts are rubber.. like with any rubber belt, they degrade and ware over time and will need replacing at some point, nozzles need cleaning, heating elements too etc. some fancy builds don't let you do much like that giving a huge limit..

anyway, Bigger companies doing atleast a limited range of printables.. i'm not sure.. The tradition quality-material guide has Metal as the worst material for Miniature models (though normally more pricey then plastic, they don't hold detail as well), followed by plastic, then resin. 3D printing is … kinda between metal and plastic.. often BELOW metal.. a decent normal printer for a home user would have something like 0.4mm nozzle diameter with a layer precision about 0.1mm. that's still pretty !SODA! big.. Casting like with plastics, have much better quality. So people will more likely have to use third partly business grade printing services.. which the prices aren't fantastic.. and will end up with the models costing MORE then if the company just released them for sale normally. You think the masterclass resins are bad? if they released them digitally, you would have to probably double it for a decent quality print..

of course, add to this the fact that piracy would be SOOO much more of a problem.. While we can kinda debate this, I have made a basic mould and cast my own heroic mushrooms from the Resin one, so I have enough for the heroes in the party. I brought the original, it's for my own use, I see that as fine. If I started to SELL my own casts? tricky.. while 3d scanners have started to have the same impact. There is someone that has even scanned and made a SDE boss printable. basically you can make your own without having to buy this readily available mini at all. I don't like that or agree with it at all.. I would be SLIGHTLY happier if it was based on the unreleased version, but even then.. it's simple bootlegging.. Doesn't matter if you issue the STL file for free, you are stealing money from the company. So I kinda guess this guy is one of the really bad moaning people they want to know where people live to attack them (god, sorry Jester, but I HATE them guys that do that).. and of course, a number of the printable sharing sites are doing the age old 'we created a place but we are unable to control it, so we should allow it to run free'.. yeah.. that'll be great fun.. "Hey guys, I have just created the Atomic bomb.. what? control? Oh, no.. I can't control it, so lets just let everyone and his dog play with it and see what happens".. kinda reminds me of a problem with Sony years ago.. CD writers had no too long come onto the market for the average person to be able to have and they sold them with adverts saying how you can make copies of your favourite music cds'.. then Sony Music started to moan and sue everyone who was using cd writers to copy their cds.. Sony's policy was mostly 'You have the right to copy our rivals work! but not ours cause we want the money'.

of course, this isn't to say that war gaming miniature casting wasn't bootlegable since pretty much the START of the field.. I've seen Metal bootlegs of metal figures when I was just a little kid.. some of the people I know only did it for there own use but still did it.

one thing that I think would help American (and British) manufacture is when local ones can product the figures themselves, or even more closer. China has been making big changes and the reports of 'sweatshops where you work in very unhealthy places with toxic materials for a couple of pence a day', but okay, fine, it's still cheaper for them to make stuff.. but some of this is case other countries like to screw themselves. I've seen some stuff from china at say, 20p each. I then see the VERY same stuff in the UK, people are selling it now for £1 or so each. import etc ontop doesn't give that kinda markup prices.. and then they moan they have to close there shops cause more people are just importing it from abroad.. no kidding.. Hell, I felt about doing it a bit myself.. I can buy some things from china, and even with all overheads, I can charge far less then a lot of people and still make enough of a profit to be doing well.. It's called Capitalism.. It's been the western way for.. god, I don't know how long.

Sorry about long mostly pointless ranting ^_^

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If you want to see some SD related stuff I've made and shared, why not check out my thread:
http://community.sodapopminiatures.com/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=14638
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July 19th, 2018, 5:10 pm
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Denizen
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Joined: October 29th, 2012, 8:56 pm
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Well in a nutshell I agree that self printable minis are a potential future in the business and industry as it’s happening now to varying levels of success. but I think we are a very long way off from when it’ll hit the breakpoint where companies shift their model towards full digital products. There will always be potential customers that lack the means to self produce or have more access or will to spend $$$ instead of their time. Likewise there is more profit for pushing minis. For example to folks that only want the minis.


July 19th, 2018, 10:37 pm
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Ninja Corps
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Joined: May 26th, 2012, 6:17 pm
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Well I was part of the chibify make your own figure that I'm sure uses 3d printers. I got 28-25mm size and created it for processing. Got word it's done and I should have it soon. I've seen other ks selling straight up files.

Oh when I get it in I'll do a comparison with SDE model.

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July 19th, 2018, 11:13 pm
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Minion
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Joined: August 17th, 2012, 8:10 am
Posts: 144
Speaking of Printables, going to hopefully get the print-and-play preview done tomorrow, are people combining the Loot and Treasure decks or just adding in the non-duplicates? Some cards are the same but a lot are different


July 22nd, 2018, 1:52 pm
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