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 Legends Update Thread 
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Mini-Boss
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yeah.. they were NAS crossovers..

Nyan-Nyan I take as her name, but her favour text clearly states that her name isn't known.

for Jack, yeah, I forgot about the plastic colour.. I more went under what name it was sold as.. It was sold as Jack Scarecrow, which was the Mini-boss name, where as ones like Nyan-Nyan was sold as Nyan-Nyan, the Hero Name.

Yep, the Alchemist had a promo card on the KS. Personally, though some people hate having to print cards out unless they use fancy overpriced printing services, I just print a card out on card stock and stick it in a card protector.. or get some better card stock ^_^

and that list of new ones looks about right. though techinally, we (or atleast depending on your pledge level) should be getting TWO of the Archne/duskweaver model

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May 15th, 2018, 3:47 pm
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Denizen
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huh? I didn't realize we'd get 2 of it? I guess...why/how?

Completionist is 1 of everything, right? I don't think there's anything above that?

So what mix yields 2? I don't think the swap to Arcade 2.0 box and spites to assumedly tile set? or just creeps? would modify that.

=======================================
Not everyone will have access to card stock or a printer that can print on card stock.

I am personally not a fan of any print and play for stuff that represents game pieces. Rules and adventures I don't mind b/c they're not part of the play board.

Although I have Arcade 2.0 and Pet Parade printed out, I am very much looking forward to have the *actual* product in hand since that's what I paid for. I mean, if someone peddled print and play bootlegs of SDE Classic/Arcade rules, would you pick these up yourself?

I don't think the SDE/SPM business model supports print and play well and so I don't have the expectation I should have to go through the overhead :).

=======================================

As for the hero/mini boss naming, I think we can agree that SPM is not known for...consistency/accuracy with their own products and that they can/just do whatever and we can expect to see more inconsistencies in the future.


May 15th, 2018, 5:22 pm
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Mini-Boss
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they said early on that they always planned to give 2 of them, but due to... fan intervention (like with a lot of the KS), they came up with the Hero Alt card. I have a couple of times in places asked about are we still getting two of that model (there are two of a number of the models cause they are bonus unlocks via pledge amounts) but the reply has just been 'if we said you'll get it, you'll get it', which pretty much has been the case.. despite some people who could moan, nothing really has been taken away from what was stated.. just expanded or tweaked. and yes, Completionist is the highest, and as part of the stretch goals you should get 2 of duskweaver, an EXTRA knight of the tower (to go with the one in the arcade set), an extra spider nest, and an extra ... I forgot what the netherelf spawning point was etc. I got the Dark consul pledge cause.. okay, great, new figures of the core box set.. but.. I see no real need for that. might pick up the boxset again sometime for that but it's not of huge interest and I kinda HATE the new glimmerdusk ranger pose.. it's like she was on a lunch break when she heard a monster, compared to the original in more of a battle ready pose.

==========
yeah, not everyone has a A4 (or bigger) printer.. most normal inkjets will print on card stock though.. not that pricey.. I'm kinda lucky since, for various reasons, I got an A3 printer (well, printer scanner). I don't have much money but I don't spend a lot, allowing me to splash out on nice things once in a while. and yeah, it's not designed for Print and Play.. while they give copies of rule books which you can print to use, if you gave away too much it would be a major bootleg problem.. it's like I say on my 3D models topic, I won't do them If SPM release there own versions cause it would be taking the money away from them. I was toying with some cardboard proxy figures like a lot of older board games have (which you can then upgrade to plastic figures when you can/want) but it wouldn't be of characters/figures that are officially released. Maybe ones that are limited and you can't get any more (like the Original Candy) but that's it. still debating bits through.

==========
and yep.. name a single company that is consistence? I've seen government documents with the odd typos and inconsistence stuff.. it happens. but yeah, SPM aren't really known for it ^_^ like forgetting some of the standard 'produce may varie' notes in places.

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May 15th, 2018, 5:42 pm
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Denizen
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@Manicman thanks for the info. Hrmm... I guess we'll see what we get when we get it, then. It definitely feels like the KS is the only cost effective option for minis compared to the resin if you're willing to wait.

Re: the new poses, I DO like they didn't just do a reprint and I do feel the new ones are higher quality. It's a bit odd to think that the next set of folks that start into SDE with this release won't necessarily know about the original model/poses! At the same time, yeah, different isn't necessarily better, but I'd feel bad about paying for reprints of old sculpts. So at least for me, the new sculpts made me excited to get some updated sculpts I could be more creative with when I get around to painting them.


May 15th, 2018, 6:24 pm
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yeah, perfectly agree about the new poses and new figures. one thing that is stopping me buying the army builder joint paint set is the figure is just the old standard barbarian. If it was an original figure or something (I would love a plastic reissue of the original candy ^_^) then I would jump at it.. I might get it if I see it in a shop but that's it. and the only shop anywhere near me that has that kinda stuff only has army builders other sets. It's just the only one I really don't like In the new core set is the new pose for the glimmerdust ranger. oh and not really keen on the fact that the barbarian is now too weak to carry her axe, but balances on top of it.. dynamic posing done wrong in any comic book 101 guide, as the americans say.

My list based on what was offered and everything means a second Arachne as a booster type figure, a second Shadow tower spawning point (7 figure single spawner), a second spider nest spawning point (8 figure single spawner) and a second Knight of the Tower. Which really, add up to a warband worth (Hero figure in Arachne, 2 spawning points, and a Mini-boss) even though they aren't a warband set.

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May 15th, 2018, 6:38 pm
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Denizen
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i love both versions of all the sculpts...... is that heresy?...... lol


May 16th, 2018, 1:47 am
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Ninja Corps
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Lizardman wrote:
i love both versions of all the sculpts...... is that heresy?...... lol


I generally like them as well. The only one I have potentially scale tipping, personal, complaints about is the reverse gender barbarian. Just because it pushes just outside of the general feel for most of the models. It's not a bad sculpt, and I will still use it. But of all of them, I probably have the most nitpicks with that guy. But, that's not even one of the alt sculpts, so it's even further removed. :D


May 16th, 2018, 1:56 am
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Who's excited for another update today?

I was admittedly laughing, probably so that I wouldn't cry, when I saw someone's recent comment saying that an owner told them a shipping/production update would be coming "soon". Partially because the last few times we got any kind of heads up about an update coming soon... Well, it wasn't good news. I mean, they've kind of got to buck the trend at some point, but I've stopped holding my breath because it only makes long waits for bad news that much more upsetting.

In the meantime though, I'm hoping this week's update is at least on par with the last one, since that was actually at least kind of relevant to the game were getting. It was interesting, since those were applicable to heroes, NPCs and villains we'll have out on the board at some point. And it seemed to generate some good chatter on the forum here again, so that's a plus.

Edit:
It looks like Ninja Scott has vanished from the visible spectrum again. We got responses from him May 3-11, and then he popped off the radar again. I half expected to see some new product launch from ND/SPM when he appeared -figured he was here to prevent the kind of backlash they got during the StarFinder campaign. Guess he just decided to pop in for a bit, or something fell through. Who knows. It was nice seeing real interaction there, and honestly it did seem to be doing some good for the tone of the comments.


May 16th, 2018, 10:23 pm
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I honestly think that they are going to not give any production info or anything on the legends updates until it's all done at this point. At least as far as the kickstarter comments go, it's nearly nothing but jugs of pure salt riding the highest horses that can't exist in nature. I don't blame them for essentially tuning out the world when it comes to updates around that.

The Relic Knight updates are perfectly informative and have a perfectly cordial and well behaved comment section for the most part. They are perfectly capable of it. But also seem to know that the legends kickstarter is nothing but a lose/lose situation. Any information isn't good enough, anything else isn't the "substantive" information that would get eviscerated anyways. That has been hammered home so hard and so many times by the "fans" that dominate the comments there and have muscled anyone who disagrees out that I have zero blame on minimal effort updates. Why try to do the impossible for the ungrateful?


May 17th, 2018, 3:47 pm
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Minion
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The Relic Knights project has also been handled VERY differently, and is in a very different place than ours -its apples and oranges. Relic Knight has not been waiting as long as Legends, has not gone through so many repeatedly kissed Target dates with little or no explanation, and most importantly has shown images of actual production line plastic samples from the factory floor. They're also next in line to ship. They haven't gone the same long months between a single voice from the company to interact with, nor have relic knights backers literally been blamed by the company for the delays of the product. They haven't gone through the pattern of inconsistent and then literally useless fluffdates that we have here either. I could accurately go on, but at the end of the day whether you love or hate SPM/ND, you've got to ignore a whole lot of logic to tell yourself that the two things are comparable.

Despite my current frustrations, I do like SPM, I like their Super Dungeon line of products, the art, the models, everything. I happen to think that while Legends admittedly seems to be a pretty intensely paired down version of what we were initially tantalized with, it's still going to be a solid product that I'll enjoy. All that said, my like for the company doesn't mean that I give them a free pass, it's quite the opposite. I want them to perform to at LEAST the industry standard (which they aren't right now, by any measure), but I'd prefer to see them doing better than the standard and being more successful as a result.


May 18th, 2018, 5:45 am
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TheHandsomeDan wrote:
Tnor have relic knights backers literally been blamed by the company for the delays of the product.


This needs a source. show me where SPM has said "if it wasn't for you backers this would be done". There's no way you're referring to them genuinely listening to the community and giving us what we asked for despite the considerable undertaking it would be. Because wording that as "blaming the backers for being late" would just come across as seriously hyperbolic and extremely dishonest spin. So, I'd like to be linked to where they blame the backers, please.


May 18th, 2018, 6:20 am
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debatable.. some delays WERE created by backers. They had most of the rules written. They didn't feel something was quite right but had no idea what. Backers playtested, gave a lot of feedback, this lead to rewrite of rules and new member of staff. This created delays.

personally, I don't think "Blame" is right, they admit the product is better for it, but it did lead to some delay because what was already done had to be redone.

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May 18th, 2018, 7:46 am
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ManicMan wrote:
debatable.. some delays WERE created by backers. They had most of the rules written. They didn't feel something was quite right but had no idea what. Backers playtested, gave a lot of feedback, this lead to rewrite of rules and new member of staff. This created delays.

personally, I don't think "Blame" is right, they admit the product is better for it, but it did lead to some delay because what was already done had to be redone.


That's what I mean. the delays absolutely are traceable back to community desires. And things like playtesting and revamping and playtesting more take time. But saying that's "blaming the backers" is like a maid coming to someones house and blaming them for the house not already being clean so they can leave or something. Doing the job that, ultimately, needed to be done is a very different thing from blaming the backers. Framing it as blame is disingenuous at best and malicious at worst.


May 18th, 2018, 9:05 am
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I believe that "Number one reason why it was delayed was due to working with customer comments" -posted in a comment on the Mistress Cavity announcement, by the official Ninja Division account on Facebook.
That conveys it pretty well.

What's funny, is this was posted almost six months AFTER we were told that Wave I was "ready to hit the go button". This wasn't in the midst of feedback and revision steps -steps which were taken at the behest of a very small portion of the backer community. That's like Microsoft saying the new Xbox will be delayed because 20 customers feel like Xbox Live needs to be restructured.

No changes have been made to the statement about Wave I being ready, except that more recently we learned they were changing factories. So now they're going to have to go through the various stages of proofing, reformatting all of their digital data, and making sure the new factory produces everything up to snuff to match previous products. I'm sure we'll hear that as a cause for further delay 2-3 months from now.

As the rules go, they finalized those, what, about a year ago? Plastic, boxes, everything else could have been going, and even then rule books are frankly something I've seen other projects revise at the last minute well into manufacturing with little to no delay.

I'm not saying all this to bash anyone, but I try to recognize all things equally. There are things which occurred that I do think fairly contributed to the delays, but there's a chasm of difference between "contributed" and "the number one reason".

A love of ice cream could accurately be said to have contributed to me being somewhat obese. The choice to prioritize other projects and tasks over exercise and healthier eating are the "number one" and two reasons that my physique more closely resembles the commonly (and incorrectly) associated image of Buddha, rather than that of Dwayne Johnson.


May 18th, 2018, 11:47 am
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TheHandsomeDan wrote:
I believe that "Number one reason why it was delayed was due to working with customer comments" -posted in a comment on the Mistress Cavity announcement, by the official Ninja Division account on Facebook.
That conveys it pretty well.


There is a big difference between explaining, or in this case, reminding people of the obvious, and "blaming". Blaming is a very loaded word which you chose specifically to use. This is not blame, it's explaining. Blame implies fault of misdeed or mistake. By saying this statement "blames the backers" you are saying that SPM is placing the fault of a mistake on the backers and are also saying that the rules revisions are also the mistake that they are at fault for. What it really sounds like is _you_ blame vocal community members for not getting things _you_ want and you are projecting it onto an otherwise innocuous statement.

TheHandsomeDan wrote:
What's funny, is this was posted almost six months AFTER we were told that Wave I was "ready to hit the go button". This wasn't in the midst of feedback and revision steps -steps which were taken at the behest of a very small portion of the backer community. That's like Microsoft saying the new Xbox will be delayed because 20 customers feel like Xbox Live needs to be restructured.


Here you seem to be implies that SPM's hands were totally tied by, using your analogy and the Xbox 360, 0.0000005% of the community and they literally had zero choice in the matter. It's not because, by your account, a fraction of the fans nearly indistinguishable from zero had a good idea they agreed with and decided to follow through on external input they agreed with. No no, it was this 0.0000005% of the fan base that FORCED them to do this kicking and screaming all the while. The evil community, victimizing SPM like this. Either that, or once again, you are projecting your own desires onto a ridiculously hyperbolic depiction of reality.

TheHandsomeDan wrote:
No changes have been made to the statement about Wave I being ready, except that more recently we learned they were changing factories. So now they're going to have to go through the various stages of proofing, reformatting all of their digital data, and making sure the new factory produces everything up to snuff to match previous products. I'm sure we'll hear that as a cause for further delay 2-3 months from now.


No changes have been made to the statement about wave 1 being ready to go...except that they had to change factories and essentially redo all the foundational work, thus completely nullifying the "ready to go" status. Other than total nullification, you're right, it's unchanged.

TheHandsomeDan wrote:
As the rules go, they finalized those, what, about a year ago? Plastic, boxes, everything else could have been going, and even then rule books are frankly something I've seen other projects revise at the last minute well into manufacturing with little to no delay.


Source needed on projects that have revised rulebooks after they started printing them with no delay. And qualifications needed for you to be able to say what could be made when and how. Not saying you're necessarily wrong or right there. But I am saying you aren't experienced enough or qualified to state anything there as fact.

TheHandsomeDan wrote:
I'm not saying all this to bash anyone, but I try to recognize all things equally. There are things which occurred that I do think fairly contributed to the delays, but there's a chasm of difference between "contributed" and "the number one reason".

A love of ice cream could accurately be said to have contributed to me being somewhat obese. The choice to prioritize other projects and tasks over exercise and healthier eating are the "number one" and two reasons that my physique more closely resembles the commonly (and incorrectly) associated image of Buddha, rather than that of Dwayne Johnson.


I can't even begin to draw a parallel between this analogy and what it seems like you're trying to state before it. You lost the thread very quickly.


May 18th, 2018, 12:22 pm
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Usagi wrote:
TheHandsomeDan wrote:
I believe that "Number one reason why it was delayed was due to working with customer comments" -posted in a comment on the Mistress Cavity announcement, by the official Ninja Division account on Facebook.
That conveys it pretty well.


There is a big difference between explaining, or in this case, reminding people of the obvious, and "blaming". Blaming is a very loaded word which you chose specifically to use. This is not blame, it's explaining. Blame implies fault of misdeed or mistake. By saying this statement "blames the backers" you are saying that SPM is placing the fault of a mistake on the backers and are also saying that the rules revisions are also the mistake that they are at fault for. What it really sounds like is _you_ blame vocal community members for not getting things _you_ want and you are projecting it onto an otherwise innocuous statement.


The 'fault' to which blame is assigned in this case, is the late status of the product. And yes, the blame for that would be on whomever made the decision to delay the project for rules revisions. But that's NOT who I'm blaming. As I go on to say, the rules were done QUITE some time ago. We were told that everything was 100% ready for the factory in September. This comment, posted in response to a complaint/inquiry about the current delays, was made nearly months after the Wave was said to be complete. The company acknowledged a fault, and stated that it was due to working with customer feedback -I don't know about where you come from, but in the American corporate environment that's pretty commonly referred to as 'blame shifting'. I'm not saying that the new rules aren't an improvement -quite to the contrary, I'm saying that they're choosing to communicate this in a way that minimizes their appearance of control or responsibility for the problem. If they said "we experienced a few extra months of delay, because we made the decision that further improvement was needed based on customer feedback." Both that and the actual statement accurately state that they spent additional time addressing feedback concerns, but this one explains a cause for delay, doesn't exaggerate the severity to which that contributed, and still takes responsibility instead of shifting it away. The two sentences contain the same overall information, there is perhaps slightly more actual information in mine, but they convey that information in a different perspective.

TheHandsomeDan wrote:
What's funny, is this was posted almost six months AFTER we were told that Wave I was "ready to hit the go button". This wasn't in the midst of feedback and revision steps -steps which were taken at the behest of a very small portion of the backer community. That's like Microsoft saying the new Xbox will be delayed because 20 customers feel like Xbox Live needs to be restructured.



Usagi wrote:
you seem to be implies that SPM's hands were totally tied by, using your analogy and the Xbox 360, 0.0000005% of the community and they literally had zero choice in the matter. It's not because, by your account, a fraction of the fans nearly indistinguishable from zero had a good idea they agreed with and decided to follow through on external input they agreed with. No no, it was this 0.0000005% of the fan base that FORCED them to do this kicking and screaming all the while. The evil community, victimizing SPM like this. Either that, or once again, you are projecting your own desires onto a ridiculously hyperbolic depiction of reality.


It's rather funny -you have a real knack for making some wildly vivid imagery out of nowhere, and then accusing others of projection. That's... telling.

I never said that the company's hands were tied. In fact, I insinuated the opposite. While the 0.00000000005% (give or take a couple decimal places) is an obvious exaggeration, made both by me and by you now, it seems a relatively tiny portion of people made these requests by comparison to the number of customers who put their money down to purchase the product without the promise of those additional revisions or other extras such as the 'pet parade' -that term literally doesn't exist on the actual campaign page. They had, what, 20 users submitting feedback after trial sessions? I work with survey data. I know how incredibly low the response rate is, and how quickly it drops based on the time investment required. I would be in shock if they got feedback from 50, but 20 unique players/groups sounds much more likely. Again, as stated in my last post, I'm not saying that revisions were a bad thing. When a handful of comments point out something that makes you think, and you decide to improve, that can be a good thing. But to describe that in the way that they did above. Makes it sound as though there was some vast surplus of feedback they somehow had to sit through -I mean, how else would "working with customer comments" be the number one reason for the delay, more than six months after those testing sessions ended, and nearly six months after you'd finished revising the rules? Must've been quite a mountain of feedback, right?

TheHandsomeDan wrote:
No changes have been made to the statement about Wave I being ready, except that more recently we learned they were changing factories. So now they're going to have to go through the various stages of proofing, reformatting all of their digital data, and making sure the new factory produces everything up to snuff to match previous products. I'm sure we'll hear that as a cause for further delay 2-3 months from now.


Usagi wrote:
No changes have been made to the statement about wave 1 being ready to go...except that they had to change factories and essentially redo all the foundational work, thus completely nullifying the "ready to go" status. Other than total nullification, you're right, it's unchanged.

Hey, that sounds, wait a minute, it's almost like he's regurgitating exactly what I just said in the same post that he's replying to...OMG he can read, thank the maker!

TheHandsomeDan wrote:
As the rules go, they finalized those, what, about a year ago? Plastic, boxes, everything else could have been going, and even then rule books are frankly something I've seen other projects revise at the last minute well into manufacturing with little to no delay.


Source needed on projects that have revised rulebooks after they started printing them with no delay. And qualifications needed for you to be able to say what could be made when and how. Not saying you're necessarily wrong or right there. But I am saying you aren't experienced enough or qualified to state anything there as fact.

Between two Kickstarter accounts, I'm closing in on roughly 100 projects that I've backed now, as well as others that I regularly follow (or did, until delivery). So finding which specific projects they were would be problematic at this point. I know of one that DID experience delays, but that wasn't due to the changes themselves, but an accumulation of the changes actually being submitted with additional errors, and then the factory becoming confused about which corrected documentation the creator actually did want, not to mention a sizeable number of cards needing to be reprinted with additional corrections (Dark Souls, translation debacle that was compounded by several issues on top of the actual retransalation.) Iacknowledge that it's not a perfect process in some cases, but seeing as the new rules are to be 100% compatible with the previous 1.5 content, it seems highly unlikely that revisions to the hero/enemy cards or even various items cards would need revision. And if they knew they were revising the rules, they could have simply submitted everything else and only provided one set of rules documentation to the factory to avoid confusion. Hell, I've heard of projects putting the manual OUTSIDE the retail package for backer orders to allow extra time without added delays. As long as they ship securely in the same package, I don't have a particular problem with that, and I don't think most folks would either.

TheHandsomeDan wrote:
I'm not saying all this to bash anyone, but I try to recognize all things equally. There are things which occurred that I do think fairly contributed to the delays, but there's a chasm of difference between "contributed" and "the number one reason".

A love of ice cream could accurately be said to have contributed to me being somewhat obese. The choice to prioritize other projects and tasks over exercise and healthier eating are the "number one" and two reasons that my physique more closely resembles the commonly (and incorrectly) associated image of Buddha, rather than that of Dwayne Johnson.


Usagi wrote:
I can't even begin to draw a parallel between this analogy and what it seems like you're trying to state before it. You lost the thread very quickly.


Projecting yet again, I see. It's really not a difficult analogy; but between projecting vivid imagery unrelated to my posts, and your astounding ability to spit back my own points as though they're somehow a counterpoint, this seems par for the course.

Just as the rules revisions CONTRIBUTED to the delays, they don't account for the majority of them; much like my love for ice cream is a contributor, but not the majority of cause for obesity. It was self deprecating humor to lighten the tone, but clearly that went over your head.

I've made a point to maintain the most civil point I can, but when you accuse me of the very thing you're unironically doing ad naseum in the same reply you're writing, it's challenging to keep snark to a minimum.


May 18th, 2018, 1:12 pm
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Hrmm...I have to agree /w Handsome Dan that there has not been communication to explain what happened b/w the supposed start of production last year and where we're at now (still no confirmed production). I think this is a fact, right? They simply said that things didn't go as planned and they're still working on starting production. If they're making progress, there is no official, public communication where they're at, dates, etc., at their discretion.

The delay in start of the original production due to the rules revisions doesn't change that latest timeline. Nor does it explain that SDE:L (rules) are still in dev since ND made the decision to put it on hold until they got production sorted out (else we'd potentially have preview materials of SDE:L like SDE:C/A/Pet Parade). I understand that doing the dev wasn't a priority for them b/c they couldn't ship it regardless without production started, but that also means all we have is beta content that is well below the threshold I would expect most fans would want to use for playtesting (which is the only product they're still maybe accepting playtest feedback, but have no presence in the feedback forum so no one uses it anymore and hangs out here).

ND/SPM have not kept promises for communication standards they set. I think this is fact.

I personally don't think ND/SPM has anyone but themselves to blame for this PR nightmare. Even if it wasn't their fault for the production delays, it's still their responsibility to handle the communication and suffer the backlash. It doesn't matter who's right/wrong/what's fair b/c the fact is the project is delayed, there is a delay in refunds, and the communication from ND/SPM is below expected standards.

But it also doesn't mean they won't (eventually) deliver and it doesn't mean they aren't working towards a solution.

At least for me, playing with the preview materials, which I don't count as delivery of any sort of product (especially with all the typos), it's increased my faith that the retail product will better align with my desires, but it is also just a distraction b/c it doesn't have any correlation with when the backer product will be produced and delivered.

So the Lore updates are ok. Hit or miss for me. I can't use them to do anything meaningful with the SDE:L beta materials, still, aside from think up of new ideas for future campaigns to work on.


May 18th, 2018, 4:51 pm
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You hit the nail right on the head there

ND/SPM have the power to fix this, and to an extent they still can. But I suspect they're somewhat content to just let it turn into a cesspool until they've got plastic popping out of molds. Not much we can do until they reach that point.

*SPARKLESTUCK!*


May 18th, 2018, 5:11 pm
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Mini-Boss
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Joined: March 22nd, 2014, 12:55 am
Posts: 527
I think you're right HandsomeDan.
SPM probably assumes that nothing is going to make the backers happy short of having plastic in their hands.


May 20th, 2018, 3:38 pm
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Moderator Ninja
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Joined: April 1st, 2012, 3:24 pm
Posts: 1806
Location: Woodbury, CT
You guys ever think that there might be a reason they haven't given a full explanation? I work in a totally unrelated manufacturing field. If we were late on a shipment to a customer and that customer went out publicly to Facebook and released press releases (kickstarter updates are basically the same thing as a press release) saying everything was our fault and we are to blame for their late products, we would probably stop selling to that customer unless their market share was large enough to warrant it (and SPM is pretty small potatoes in the plastic toy market).

Now there are only a couple of companies who manufacture the product SPM makes. They are all hyper aware of what transpires in the industry. You move the shoulder of blame to the manufacturers and name names, none of them will want to ever produce anything for you.

Couple that with the fact that some of the initial delay updates were met with vitriol and tack on some the of the public and private comments people have sent to SPM employees, I wouldn't say a thing if I were them. Some of the comments are extremely close to having to get police involved. I saw a post on one forum where someone was threatening physical harm if they didn't get their plastic dudes. What can you post to make people happy?


May 21st, 2018, 12:16 pm
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