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 Is dex base defense on dex based heroes unstopable? 
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Minion
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Joined: March 13th, 2012, 7:59 pm
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Hello,

I've played few games with the new rules and I noticed a problem with the dex based defence.
With old rules (if my memory serves me right) you were not able to 'dodge' with dex while knocked down. Now you can use the dex based defence whenever you want if your character has a shield next to it.

This makes the heroes that defend and attack with dex unstoppable as they don't need to trade offense for defense (or the other way around).

I had a game with the Ninja Cola where I could do nothing against her, even with the dungeon boss as she had 8 dice to attack and defend each time from all the items (that got constantly upgraded to better dice ones)

Did I miss something or there's no way of stopping such heroes once they get some loot?


December 27th, 2015, 6:24 am
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Consul
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Yes. Heroes who use the same stat for defense and offense are unstoppable.

In comparison Heroes who use two stats would be allowed to wear two pieces of equipment in each slot.
That's how powerful it is. It IS just that OP...

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December 27th, 2015, 6:33 am
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Ninja Corps
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Joined: March 25th, 2012, 9:44 pm
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Jasper wrote:
Hello,

I've played few games with the new rules and I noticed a problem with the dex based defence.
With old rules (if my memory serves me right) you were not able to 'dodge' with dex while knocked down. Now you can use the dex based defence whenever you want if your character has a shield next to it.

This makes the heroes that defend and attack with dex unstoppable as they don't need to trade offense for defense (or the other way around).

I had a game with the Ninja Cola where I could do nothing against her, even with the dungeon boss as she had 8 dice to attack and defend each time from all the items (that got constantly upgraded to better dice ones)

Did I miss something or there's no way of stopping such heroes once they get some loot?


Ninja Cola is both an anomaly and considered the most broken, OP, hero in the game because of just that. But, he is the only hero in the game that has base attack and base defense on the same stat as well. So, it's less that using dex as defense is overpowered (it's not). It's that ninja cola is overpowered. The only other character I can think of that comes close would be princess malya, who uses dex as a base defense, and has a 2 action, dex based, special attack. This makes her quite powerful as well. In a much more limited sense, there are a handful of heroes that use will as defense, and other heroes that have attack potions that use will. Those things can combine and become pretty strong. But, at that point, i see it more as a powerful combo, not something inherently OP.


December 27th, 2015, 6:43 am
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Minion
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I don't mind using special actions for the attack as this means you can't attack 5 times each round with it.
It's just that I remember previously for example Riftling Rouge had Dodge that allowed here to defend with Dex, but it did not work when she was knocked down. Now there's no such disadvantage to Dex based defense, leaving Ninja Cola with no openings at all :)


December 28th, 2015, 7:43 am
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Ninja Corps
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Jasper wrote:
I don't mind using special actions for the attack as this means you can't attack 5 times each round with it.
It's just that I remember previously for example Riftling Rouge had Dodge that allowed here to defend with Dex, but it did not work when she was knocked down. Now there's no such disadvantage to Dex based defense, leaving Ninja Cola with no openings at all :)


yeah, they basically equalized (and simplified) attack and defense. There's no special rules anymore like not being able to defend while knocked down, or not being able to attack adjacent to you. All defenses are "equal" in that none of them have special rules that apply just to them. The same goes for attacks, now, as well. You just use the stat associated with the icon at the range indicated with no restrictions inherent to the type of attack.


December 28th, 2015, 9:00 am
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Mini-Boss
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Beatrix, The Witch Queen is the answer you seek young padawan. 8-) Hardcounters everything that is good about Ninja Cola. So if they are the last mini standing against her you have basically won the game. It is almost so I suspect that SDE designed her to be the Cola killer on purpose... Hmm? Could anyone confirm if this is the case? D:

EDIT: However, I still find Cola a stupid and annoying model, not because I find them broken, but because I find them too good for being that easy to play... I do rather lose any day to a party built on several combo's inbetween members of the party than "Cola's Solo Adventure" as that gets very boring to watch as a consul.

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January 5th, 2016, 10:35 pm
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Goblin-King wrote:
Yes. Heroes who use the same stat for defense and offense are unstoppable.

In comparison Heroes who use two stats would be allowed to wear two pieces of equipment in each slot.
That's how powerful it is. It IS just that OP...


Woah woah woah. If a hero has two defense stats, they can wear up to 8 pieces of equipment?! crazy! Is that clarified in the rulebook somewhere? Just wanted to get some visual on it before I tell my buddies and they laugh at me. I did not know this. I'm assuming it's still 1 treasure piece tho right?


February 25th, 2016, 11:03 am
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Consul
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NO! You misread this completely.

It's was an example to illustrate how powerful it is to use the same stat for offense and defense.
Such a hero would stack 4 pieces of equipment with only one stat (Dex).
He would get a boost to his offence 4 times - And he would get a boost to his defense 4 times. Effectively getting boosted 8 times from just 4 equipment.

That's why a regular hero should wear 8 pieces of equipment to reach the same powerlevel. But he can't though!
And heroes who only use one stat shouldn't exist.

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February 25th, 2016, 1:49 pm
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Goblin-King wrote:
And heroes who only use one stat shouldn't exist.


Well said. He may as well not have Str / Will on the card. (Although maybe there are some Will v Will, Str v Str abilities you would throw at him, but I have yet to find that)


February 25th, 2016, 10:08 pm
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Mini-Boss
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[house_rules] Use the old rule of knock down or apply it on slow to prevent usage of DEX for defense purposes. Also if you feels lack of old status choke to prevent heroes to drink potions, just add this feature on poison. [/house_rules]

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February 26th, 2016, 10:19 am
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Minion
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They apparently reprinted ninja cola, though i'm not sure how we can get a copy of the new card if we didn't pick up ninja all stars


February 26th, 2016, 12:22 pm
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Mini-Boss
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They put available Super Dungeon Ninja Ambush Pack with every crossover miniatures. A kind of Level Box.

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February 29th, 2016, 3:42 pm
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I actually noticed in another thread that someone posted a link to the comparison of cards. Unfortunately I don't recall who posted or the name of the thread, but I had the image handy Image


March 1st, 2016, 2:08 pm
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