View unanswered posts | View active topics It is currently May 23rd, 2017, 7:37 am

Reply to topic  [ 3 posts ] 
 Thoughts on Victory Conditions 
Author Message
User avatar

Joined: September 9th, 2012, 1:25 am
Posts: 173
Location: Australia
The current rules on Victory Conditions are an evolution of the 1.0 rules via 1.5 with changes for 2.0 bolted onto them. This creates some strange interactions where old Conditions have been changed greatly and parts of the new rules seem to have been inherited from the ideas underlying the older rules. So here are some suggestions for streamlining the Victory Conditions and hopefully improving that area of the game in line with other changes that have come with 2.0.

Change Infuse so only Heroes can do it. Then remove the need for Held Esper. This makes the rules simpler without increasing or decreasing the speed at which Infuse tokens can be placed significantly.

Change Act As One .....never mind...see next 2 posts.

Change Calamity and Crystal Harvest to Primary Conditions and follow the usual rules for Primary Conditions. This allows the Flip of a Void/Wild card to just be a reflip for a Secondary in the determining Conditions section of set up and reduces rules in the book and rules burden in play.

Change Secure Perimeter, Espionage and Grand Conjunction to need a movement between starting the attempt and finishing it (cf Conservation and Heist). This ensures that the Primary Conditions are all more difficult in some way than the Secondary Conditions.

Change all Conditions to Flip 4 to score. This makes Conditions more reliable and thus more viable in games and it makes 1 rule for all conditions (reducing rules burden). It doesn't matter that the relative complexity of the different conditions is different, it is harder to complete a Primary so it has a larger reward. Also only 2 Conditions will be present in a game so it doesn't matter that Tear it Down is harder than Conservation (but it does matter that Secure Perimeter, Espionage and Grand Conjunction are no harder than a Secondary Condition currently hence the prior change). This point in particular took me a while to arrive at, the current rules are derived from the old need to have different chances of success based on the difficulty of the Condition because the players would have different Conditions, but as both players have the same Conditions this variation is no longer relevant (though perhaps a side bar highlighting the difficulty difference for players wanting different Conditions would be a good addition).

Tear it a Down and Assassination keep their reward for killing things without getting them from Flips. Because it is possible to destroy the needed target without scoring all the VP. (ie the only change is to the number of cards flipped for these 2).

Defence of Life gains text so that the opponent chooses a new unit after a token has been deposited until 3 VP are gained. Because currently you can deposit and get 0 VP, but gaining 3 VP for just depositing is too simple, but requiring collecting a token makes it on par to some Primary conditions.

Thoughts from others?

Australian Soda Pop Community On Facebook

Last edited by Obsidian-Crane on May 6th, 2017, 3:00 am, edited 2 times in total.

May 6th, 2017, 1:52 am
Profile WWW
User avatar

Joined: August 27th, 2012, 5:11 am
Posts: 253
The recommendation to change Act as One is unnecessary, the rules for Deposit specifically state that you cannot retrieve and deposit on the same activation.

For Tear it Down and Assassination, are you suggesting doing away with flips on them entirely? As it stands, if you destroy the target before scoring the total possible, you score the remainder.

Otherwise these changes are worth considering/testing.

I would also be curious to know if going back to static scoring has been considered with the game being deadlier and the problematic speed of Cerci having been reduced. It feels to me that the idea to introduce flips came before the other changes were fully tested; and therefore may have worked as intended before, but now the unreliable nature of flips has lead to a shift where combat is the preferred option regardless of which units you build a cadre with.

May 6th, 2017, 2:31 am
User avatar

Joined: September 9th, 2012, 1:25 am
Posts: 173
Location: Australia
Act As One: ah I missed that. Another thing at the end that could be at the start to stop it being missed.

Tear it Down & Assassinate still Flip, they would still work as they do now.

The reasons for Flips are more complicated. I may not like them, but if we have to have them then I'd rather see consistent applicaction of them for ease of learning and use in play.

Australian Soda Pop Community On Facebook

May 6th, 2017, 2:55 am
Profile WWW
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Reply to topic   [ 3 posts ] 

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot] and 1 guest

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
Designed by STSoftware.